From Scratch 2nd Time Around

[Limey]

Ok measured up and have taken pics and trying to translate my scraps of paper lay outs into something worth posting here.

Bob... I like your idea a lot. Decided I should get rid of my old thinking and listen and read . The filter will be just like you said Bob, vortexes 1 static and 1 agitated k1 - one or two... depends on final size of pond. I have been granted a lot more room than I expected so we will see how big I go... I got granted it after I said Bob said I needed it... so expect a knock at your door from she who must... and will [usually] be obeyed .

Ok hope to post the plan and the garden pics I took later tonight or tomorrow or combo of the both .

The QT tank I will make a seperate thread on... this is puzzling me big time, think you will understand when I post pics and a plan .

Bob and everyone else who posted suggestions etc here thank you very much, I have done a complete rethink of my old ideas...

Regards Dave

[not one of the other Daves]

ps To give you an idea of how long I have loved koi I have the aol email address nishikigoi@aol.com - only reason I haven't switched from aol heh... I don't really use that address so don't check it often so if you test me to see if I do have it let me know so I check and reply

[Gazza]

Hi Dave,

Yes a set or two of vortex's will work OK i have four on my system and all with K1

[Limey]

Sigh wrote a reply in my usual ramble then messed up posting it GRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR... ok gonna try again...

Wife was very obliging after I told her Bob said I had to have as much room as possible.... [bolt your door and close the curtains Bob just in case She who must nearly always be obeyed tracks you down.... ).

Have a plan and pics to post. Not sure if they will show up ok but will try [again].... The plan is the max size the pond could be - I wont have one less than 4' deep and thinking 5' would be ideal so pond volume would be between 4 and 5000 gallons ish without filters depending on depth. I wont compromise more than 2 feet off width and length giving me 3000 gallons plus x. If finances are such I cant have that will bite the bullet and wait anohter year... just know 1 year could become 2... 3... etc etc . Anyway, would have my QT to keep me happy heh... and sheesh that is a puzzle... and will need help Gazza, Bob and all to try and solve it . Will start another thread.

Anyway, all depends on share options coming out next Feb and how nice my in laws etc are going to be... got em here for Christmas so gonna pick the right drunken moment for commitment and get em to put in writing in case they say they don't remember . So get buying shares you guys drive the prices UP till Feb anyway!

Okies lets see if I can post the stuff this time... Plan first then actual pics....

[url=http://pets.webshots.com/photo/2261224760048918036JdgjBU][img]http://inlinethumb15.webshots.com/11854/226 ... 600Q85.jpg[/img][/url]

[Limey]

Okies Great seems to work woo hoo... if you click on plan takes you to host and then can see it full screen [ish] which makes the dimensions easier to see ok flushed with success....

This one is the actual area the pond will be the path in the top left corner is the path on the plan

[url=http://pets.webshots.com/photo/2608523300048918036RVKLzH][img]http://inlinethumb01.webshots.com/43328/260 ... 425Q85.jpg[/img][/url]

This is other side of fence you can see in the above pic [top left to right] so it would be possible to put filters this side of the fence, lots of room car stops at non pot holed bit... what may be a problem is a manhole near the gate... have a pic of it to follow...

[url=http://pets.webshots.com/photo/2988793490048918036mMxAXi][img]http://inlinethumb26.webshots.com/45401/298 ... 425Q85.jpg[/img][/url]

This is the manhole and makes me wonder what maybe under the ground where I intend to build ;/

[url=http://pets.webshots.com/photo/2158204370048918036UVVfVh][img]http://inlinethumb48.webshots.com/29743/215 ... 425Q85.jpg[/img][/url]

Fired this one off of the side garden was thinking maybe a little wildlife pond? More room here but not as private...

[url=http://pets.webshots.com/photo/2419488450048918036rvPWnm][img]http://inlinethumb26.webshots.com/46169/241 ... 425Q85.jpg[/img][/url]

Well thats about it for this for a while methinks... have other questions that more reading may well solve, or will ask them in right parts of forum and then come back to this when I have a clear idea of what I am able to do... but done it will be! Don't want to bore everyone too much on this or you will stop reading and helping .

[eds]

Looks like a nice spot for your pond, if there aren't any drains or other services underneath there!!!!

If it were me I'd put both filters on the same side and run the bottom drains both to there. Yes you'll need a bit more 4" pipe but then when you're cleaning you'll have it all in the same spot and can hopefully not need to double up on air pumps, drain pipework, a filter housing etc. that you might have to with two seperate filters as you have planned it.

Also what filtration are you going to run off the skimmer?

[Gazza]

You defiantly have enough room there and if your lucky the drain pipes wont get in the way and also you can plumb into this for you waste water

If you can put the filters both the same side like Ed has said will be a good idea as you will only need the services one end and it will make things easier.If the pond is around 4-5000 you could get away with one bottom drain and skimmer and have perhaps i skimmer onto another bank of filtration.On my pond i run four vortex units all coupled together directly from the bottom drain and then from the skimmer and a mid feed both get pumped over a shower and my pond is 4500 and it works OK.

[Limey]

Thanks Ed and Gazza... would be easier as where Filter 1 is the drains are close by... umm maybe too close heh... I sort of liked the idea of having 2 bottom drains and 2 seperate filters - not sure why I like it heh.

Eds... my plan is to run 1 skimmer into where my QT area is going to be [in the first pic there is a door next to the green eco bin... that is going to be my QT area will post plan and pics today and need your grains here to advise best way to make use] - the idea is to have a uv in there and be able to some point add heating. I think it could be set to turn off uv/heating whenever I didn't need it. Or just have either heating or uv as and when. So strictly speaking no real filtration.

However, would like to be able to add shower for pond so in my iminds eye had 2nd skimmer running a disguised shower shooting water back into pond from filter 2 area. The option for skimmer 1 to be able to return a shower or be used uv/heat as above. If 1 skimmer was either shower or uv/heating thinking I am then letting any shower beneficial bactera die - don't think I would use shower in winter because of potential heat loss but would be a problem in summer when I may well need to use the uv at leat some of the time?

I think 2 seperate filters running off their own bottom drain would be best do you think? Having just 1 larger filter bay would def save me some room and the suggestion to have them all the same end [sensible place where filter 1 is] makes a lot of sense.

Would you say for a pond up to 5,000 gals that 3 foot diam vortexes around 3 foot high would do the job? 2 independent each with a static followed by agitated k1 set up ? Then skimmers to independently add the things above at some point ... uv/heating/shower? If you went 1 bottom drain on pond that size would you simply make it 2 static k1 followed by 2 agitated in series? Would 1 static then 2 agitated be good enough?

Thanks again for your input.

[Gazza]

The idea behind the static K1 is it acts as a mechanical filter so this will stop any waste and stuff getting into the bio stages of your filtration so after that it cn all be moving and bubbling away.The beauty of doing it this was is you can use smaller vortex's like mine which are only 600mm of which i have four the first one being set upo for static K1 and the other three are all bio stages with moving K1.

I personally would have everything the drain end to make things easier and of course if you want two bottom drains go for it and if you do have a shower you can always enclose it so it doesn't chill the water to much during the winter as mine sits on the back of my pond and is enclosed in poly carb.Or depending how high your filter house is the shower could be fixed inside and then piped back to the pond

[Limey]

Okies that makes sense. Understood the static being the mechanical part - was trying to get my head round 1 being sufficient, I am not going to argue with someone that has proved it thank you. 600 mm is that the diameter? Would really appreciate dimensions - height diam, assuming 4" from pond and 2" outlets? The protecting of the shower sounds good and skim it from filter 1 area. I have read with GREAT interest your diy shower and am going to use my useless skills on it as part of my QT set up... so like Bob Gazza if it doesn't work close the curtains cos she who must be obeyed will be visiting... told her that this time around there wont be lots of tweaking and changes and pipes and boxes and mucky stuff around cos I am getting good advice... so your fault if I don't keep to that

Right now am thinking 1 bottom drain and 1 filter a la Gazza - preferably 2 skimmers, 1 for uv and heat eventually and perhaps extra filtration and other to add a shower to. Great advice and input, yet again MUCH appreciated guys!

[Gazza]

Sounds like we are getting the blame for this one Bob

I am not 100% on the sizes but i think they are 600mm x 1000mm and i have four all coupled together with 2 x 4" pipe so i get a good flow through the filters at all times and there is over 300lts of K1 in them on the bio stages and about 30-40lts in the static one this is all fed from a 4" bottom drain and is pumped back to the pond through 2" pipe.

Why not put the heating in the bottom drain filter as this will always bee running and then you can have the UV on the skimmer line

The QT is easy just knock one up and then use some crates or boxes and pump the water fast over some BHM job done nice and easy

[Limey]

Hiya Gazza... I have to say Bob said I HAVE to do this or Gazza said I HAVE to do this.... worked so far got half the back garden

UV/Heating was just thinking I can pipe that to the QT house which is just a few feet away - then can easily turn 1 or both off if not being used, and if at some point I wanted to put say a static ki vortex on it or even plug into qt filtration if that isn't operating. Should be able to have it as a real flexible seperate unit if you know what I mean.

QT tank... heh well am not bothered about pretty here Just as long as it holds water heh... its kind of strange though and know I keep saying this but the pics will maybe explain better. I need to go out and climb a ladder and measure something... will maybe do that after a umm coffee then sit back here with a nice drink and post .

Just dropped the wife off at a girls night out... am freeeeeeeeeeeee.....

Regards Dave

[Bob Hart]

Dave,

Glad to see things are progressing along nicely. Many people use Nexus's which are static and aerated K1 and work really well. Gazza and myself (and many others on here) just use Vortex's converted to do much the same job.

I'll see what Photo's I can dig out of my vortex converstions. You'd be very welcome to bring your missus for as visit to see them in use, but a long way for you to come!Anyone can do what I have done, although I do do fibreglassing so it's easier for me to join things together, but there are many glassers about who could help you if needed.

[Limey]

Gazza something I wanted to ask... 600 mm is what you think maybe the diam and the other is height yes?

[Gazza]

Hi Dave,

Yes its 600mm wide i believe i think they hold about 50 gallons.

[Limey]

Bob I would LOVE to see the conversions... and funny you mention fibreglassing... could you check my thread on QT build - been thinking that I could have a go at making the bottom tank by fibreglassing - have most of the wall there would just need to build the end bit and render that part... 9 sq meteres would probably do it and be sort of fun to give it a go...

Kent... it is a LONG way - used to take some trips down there my middle daughter used to come on my week end trips to visit koi places when she was little heh... hmmm think Koi Water Barn and then there was a very big place that was fairly new lots of land and think it was someone that used to be at koi water barn that started it? Anyway, really would like to see the vortex conversion, and would love to pay a visit sometime thank you.

Regards Dave