Hi,
Was just wondering what i will require with regards to electric supply to the pond, on my last pond i just had a cable a nd an outside junction box plugged into a breaker-im guessing this wont be suitable for a pernament fixture? How do i protect the wire on route to the pond?
Cheers Andy
Electric supply to pond???
Moderators: B.Scott, vippymini, Gazza, Manky Sanke
-
macaws fly
- Nurse Shark
- Posts: 122
- Joined: Tue Dec 27, 2005 8:49 pm
- Location: north herts
-
Gazza
- architeuthis moderator
- Posts: 5306
- Joined: Sat Aug 13, 2005 7:24 pm
- Location: Essex,UK
- Contact:
Hi Andy,
depending on what you want to run off the supply and where you are going to put it all.
Normally a small feed like a 2.4mm SWA cable is enough to run most ponds but it does depend on length of run and if you going to start running heater etc in the future.
Remember water and electrics don't mix so you need to make sure you can keep it all out of the open and use waterproof equipment if necessary.
depending on what you want to run off the supply and where you are going to put it all.
Normally a small feed like a 2.4mm SWA cable is enough to run most ponds but it does depend on length of run and if you going to start running heater etc in the future.
Remember water and electrics don't mix so you need to make sure you can keep it all out of the open and use waterproof equipment if necessary.
Hi,
I was going to hire in a mini digger again to run a trench to near the main fuse box, which is by the drain and water supply. Then run electrics with a drain pipe and water supply pipe to the pond, will hopefully build a water proof area for a junction box. Will be for two pumps, air pumps and uv-unfortunately she wont let me heat it! Will i need to get a new junction box installed or can i just use a plug socket with a trip switch on, was worried it would overload a plug socket??
Cheers Andy
I was going to hire in a mini digger again to run a trench to near the main fuse box, which is by the drain and water supply. Then run electrics with a drain pipe and water supply pipe to the pond, will hopefully build a water proof area for a junction box. Will be for two pumps, air pumps and uv-unfortunately she wont let me heat it! Will i need to get a new junction box installed or can i just use a plug socket with a trip switch on, was worried it would overload a plug socket??
Cheers Andy
Hello Andy, idealy you need to pick up you supply from a spare way in your consumer unit that is suitably rated for the supply cable and equipment that it will feed. All out door supplies must be covered by and earth leakage trip, (rcd)
As for your cable you are always best to use a steel wire armoured (SWA) cable. you can use a 3 core 1.5mm cable which has a current carrying capacity of approx 20amps. and 2.5mm cable is approx 28amps.
basically you need to know what equipment it will supply to give you your total wattage i.e 200 watts for a pump, 55 watts for the uv, etc etc. you can then work out what amps you will need.
As a basic guide 1 kilowatt is 1000 watts and 250 watts is equal to 1amp, so therefore 1kw is about 4 amps. ( this is not exact but for the purpose of a guide to working out your total load it is fine).
as for the junction box idea it depends what you mean by junction box, you could terminate the swa cable into a weather proof socket or fused spur and feed thru it to as many sockets as you need. they are not cheap but are reliable and safe.
If it is any help to you you can email me or call me for more help.
Just remember this, if you cut corners on the pond build the worse that will happen is there will be a leak, cut corners on the electrics and it can be FATAL.......
As for your cable you are always best to use a steel wire armoured (SWA) cable. you can use a 3 core 1.5mm cable which has a current carrying capacity of approx 20amps. and 2.5mm cable is approx 28amps.
basically you need to know what equipment it will supply to give you your total wattage i.e 200 watts for a pump, 55 watts for the uv, etc etc. you can then work out what amps you will need.
As a basic guide 1 kilowatt is 1000 watts and 250 watts is equal to 1amp, so therefore 1kw is about 4 amps. ( this is not exact but for the purpose of a guide to working out your total load it is fine).
as for the junction box idea it depends what you mean by junction box, you could terminate the swa cable into a weather proof socket or fused spur and feed thru it to as many sockets as you need. they are not cheap but are reliable and safe.
If it is any help to you you can email me or call me for more help.
Just remember this, if you cut corners on the pond build the worse that will happen is there will be a leak, cut corners on the electrics and it can be FATAL.......
Hi Stoney,
Thanks for your reply, unfortunately im a dab hand with vechicle electrics but only ever work with up to 72volts! I was planning to build some kind of bricked area with a roof to house the pumps etc and was going to use one of the waterproof connector boxes with switched out puts. Not sure if i will have a spare section on my fuse box inside the house-looks at least twice as old as me-was planning to have it moved in the future to eventually make room for indoor qt so may kill two birds with one stone! Will get a sparky in for that bit!
Thanks for your kind offer of help-il work out how much current i will be drawing from what you told me and if its ok could i just get you too double check for me? Where would i get armoured cable from?
Once again thanks for the help-hard work this pond building lark!
Cheers Andy
Thanks for your reply, unfortunately im a dab hand with vechicle electrics but only ever work with up to 72volts! I was planning to build some kind of bricked area with a roof to house the pumps etc and was going to use one of the waterproof connector boxes with switched out puts. Not sure if i will have a spare section on my fuse box inside the house-looks at least twice as old as me-was planning to have it moved in the future to eventually make room for indoor qt so may kill two birds with one stone! Will get a sparky in for that bit!
Thanks for your kind offer of help-il work out how much current i will be drawing from what you told me and if its ok could i just get you too double check for me? Where would i get armoured cable from?
Once again thanks for the help-hard work this pond building lark!
Cheers Andy
-
Telthepondman
- Sandbar shark
- Posts: 24
- Joined: Mon Jan 29, 2007 8:47 pm
I think one of our qualified members should post and explain part "P" of the building regulations, it is just not wise to carry out your own garden electrics anymore without a registered sparks to certify the work. Heaven forbid someone catches a packet or worse still ends up dead, just to save a few bob. Not only that pretty soon. you will not be able to sell your property without a certificate of recent works, which any surveyor worth his sorts will pick up on.
Tel.
Tel.
Hi Tel,
I had to remove a couple of sockets and the wiring to the shed when we sold our flat because the estate agents needed certificates to say it had been installed correctly! Will certainly get a sparky to wire in the power supply to the garden as like you say best to get someone who knows what they are doing in!
Hi Gazza,
Not sure on how much-will have a quick measure up tommorrow and let you know!
Cheers Andy
I had to remove a couple of sockets and the wiring to the shed when we sold our flat because the estate agents needed certificates to say it had been installed correctly! Will certainly get a sparky to wire in the power supply to the garden as like you say best to get someone who knows what they are doing in!
Hi Gazza,
Not sure on how much-will have a quick measure up tommorrow and let you know!
Cheers Andy
Hello Andy, I will be hapy to give you any advise I can that might make things easier to understand and point you in the right direction. As for where to get cable from, you can get it from most DIY places, B+Q etc but if you can find an electrical wholesaler near you they can cut what you want to length and supply you with the glands to terminate it too (depending what you do at either end) you will also find that it should be much cheeper at an wholesaler rather than a diy store.
As for the PART "P" of the building regulations, it is a bit of a mind field and full of grey areas but in theory it is/should be a good thing for everyone as it should ensure all work is carried out correctly and safely, (it is the electrical equivelent of CORGIE for gas)
If anyone knows more about the part p ect than me then please expand or correct me if I am incorrect, but here is a brief explanation and a few things that effect us.
As of January 2006 part p of the building regulations came into force. This means that only suitably competent people should work on domestic circuits. I also stipulates that some work is notifiable and some is not. All work in "wet" areas, i.e kitchens, bathrooms and all outside supplies are notifiable to the buildings control department.
If a person feels they are competent to do there own electrical work they are still permitted to do this if they do so by following the correct procedure. You must give 48 hours notice of works being undertaken to the buildings contol department at you local council, you need to work to part p and 16th edition (bs7671) guidlines, you then do the "first fix" and inform the buildings inspector when this is done, he will then MAYBE come and check it. You then complete the work and you must then get a Part p registered electrician to come and test, inspect and certify your work.
If the person wanting the work done is not competent then he must use an electrician who is competent, the electrician does not need to be part p registerd to do the work but if he is not then he must follow the same procedure as above. If he is registered then he basically comes to you, does the work and certifies his own work.
All outdoor supplies must be covered by an earthleakage trip(rcd) and any socket in the house that is liable to supply any portable outdoor equipment, i.e pressure washer, lighting etc must also be covered by an rcd.
Part p effects any person doing any electrical work, plumbers, kitchen fitters, heating engineers etc but the number of people who do comply with part p is debatable.
if anyone has any specific questions I would be wiling to try to answer them for you, and as I say if anyone knows more about part p please speak up to help all have a clearer understaning of it.
Stoney
As for the PART "P" of the building regulations, it is a bit of a mind field and full of grey areas but in theory it is/should be a good thing for everyone as it should ensure all work is carried out correctly and safely, (it is the electrical equivelent of CORGIE for gas)
If anyone knows more about the part p ect than me then please expand or correct me if I am incorrect, but here is a brief explanation and a few things that effect us.
As of January 2006 part p of the building regulations came into force. This means that only suitably competent people should work on domestic circuits. I also stipulates that some work is notifiable and some is not. All work in "wet" areas, i.e kitchens, bathrooms and all outside supplies are notifiable to the buildings control department.
If a person feels they are competent to do there own electrical work they are still permitted to do this if they do so by following the correct procedure. You must give 48 hours notice of works being undertaken to the buildings contol department at you local council, you need to work to part p and 16th edition (bs7671) guidlines, you then do the "first fix" and inform the buildings inspector when this is done, he will then MAYBE come and check it. You then complete the work and you must then get a Part p registered electrician to come and test, inspect and certify your work.
If the person wanting the work done is not competent then he must use an electrician who is competent, the electrician does not need to be part p registerd to do the work but if he is not then he must follow the same procedure as above. If he is registered then he basically comes to you, does the work and certifies his own work.
All outdoor supplies must be covered by an earthleakage trip(rcd) and any socket in the house that is liable to supply any portable outdoor equipment, i.e pressure washer, lighting etc must also be covered by an rcd.
Part p effects any person doing any electrical work, plumbers, kitchen fitters, heating engineers etc but the number of people who do comply with part p is debatable.
if anyone has any specific questions I would be wiling to try to answer them for you, and as I say if anyone knows more about part p please speak up to help all have a clearer understaning of it.
Stoney
Hello Gazza, i am an electrician but not part p registered. as I was saying the whole thing is very vague, what is competent??? it doesnt stiplulate what competent is, i.e it doesnt state you have to have completed an apprnticeship or what if any qualifications you must have.
The 16th edition, (bs7671) are the guidlines you follow under part p but these are not a statutary thing and so in theory you dont need to follow them but lets assume you didnt and someone was electrocuted then the 16th edition will be used as a basis for you prosecution.
The 16th edition, (bs7671) are the guidlines you follow under part p but these are not a statutary thing and so in theory you dont need to follow them but lets assume you didnt and someone was electrocuted then the 16th edition will be used as a basis for you prosecution.
-
Gazza
- architeuthis moderator
- Posts: 5306
- Joined: Sat Aug 13, 2005 7:24 pm
- Location: Essex,UK
- Contact:
Hi Stoney,
Yes i agree with you and it can be a bit of a mine field to be honest but the trouble is there are too many bits and pieces that need to be cleaned up as it can be confusing
In a court of law they will state that a "competent person" working on electricity is an Electrician and so would be suitably trained.........so they say
No persons shall be engaged in any work activity where technical knowledge or experience is necessary to prevent danger or,where appropriate,injury,unless he possesses such knowledge or experience,or is under such degree of supervision as may be appropriate having regard to the nature of the work.
This is from regulation 16 EWR
If you where to ask the IEE what qualifications do you need to be an electrician they will send you in the direction of the C&G 2330 P1 & P2 and there are also some NVQ and a Level 2 qualification for some domestic use.
There is and has been lots of talk and in some of the recent publication after "competent" it says in brackets Qualified so it can be just as confusing for us poor old spark's on the ground as it for the consumer who's trying to get some work done
Yes i agree with you and it can be a bit of a mine field to be honest but the trouble is there are too many bits and pieces that need to be cleaned up as it can be confusing
In a court of law they will state that a "competent person" working on electricity is an Electrician and so would be suitably trained.........so they say
No persons shall be engaged in any work activity where technical knowledge or experience is necessary to prevent danger or,where appropriate,injury,unless he possesses such knowledge or experience,or is under such degree of supervision as may be appropriate having regard to the nature of the work.
This is from regulation 16 EWR
If you where to ask the IEE what qualifications do you need to be an electrician they will send you in the direction of the C&G 2330 P1 & P2 and there are also some NVQ and a Level 2 qualification for some domestic use.
There is and has been lots of talk and in some of the recent publication after "competent" it says in brackets Qualified so it can be just as confusing for us poor old spark's on the ground as it for the consumer who's trying to get some work done
Hello again Gazza,
I know what you say with regard to competent and qualified etc etc, there is no clear guidlines and set rules. If they were so ademant about part p working and only the "competent" people doing the work then surely it must become impossible for "joe public" to go to a diy store and buy ALL that you need for any electrical work from a replacment socket thru to full rewire and consumer unit change.
I feel that if someone is going to do any work for themselves, (and not notify or have work certified) then lets hope they will atleast know what they are doing or atleast seek guidence and advice from someone who does know.
Here's a question someone might be able to answer allthough only slightly koi related.
You decide to heat your pond via a gas boiler, this obviously needs an electrical supply for it but the "plumber" is not suitably qualified or competent in electrics so he does all his stuff and leaves. next day Mr Elctrician comes, runs a supply from the comsumer unit from a spare way to a weather proof fused spur. Mr electrician then has a dilema as he is not corgy registered so is not able to work on gas boilers,
Who's responsiblity/job is it to conect it and power it up?
I don't know if you have ever rung the IEE technical help line but they are usually helpfull people.
I know what you say with regard to competent and qualified etc etc, there is no clear guidlines and set rules. If they were so ademant about part p working and only the "competent" people doing the work then surely it must become impossible for "joe public" to go to a diy store and buy ALL that you need for any electrical work from a replacment socket thru to full rewire and consumer unit change.
I feel that if someone is going to do any work for themselves, (and not notify or have work certified) then lets hope they will atleast know what they are doing or atleast seek guidence and advice from someone who does know.
Here's a question someone might be able to answer allthough only slightly koi related.
You decide to heat your pond via a gas boiler, this obviously needs an electrical supply for it but the "plumber" is not suitably qualified or competent in electrics so he does all his stuff and leaves. next day Mr Elctrician comes, runs a supply from the comsumer unit from a spare way to a weather proof fused spur. Mr electrician then has a dilema as he is not corgy registered so is not able to work on gas boilers,
Who's responsiblity/job is it to conect it and power it up?
I don't know if you have ever rung the IEE technical help line but they are usually helpfull people.