This Section Is For Advanced Hobbyists Discussing new original cutting edge Experimental and Trial Treatments and Surgical Techniques, here we take koi health and pond keeping to the next level
OK as the heading says do you have anything in particular you do when treating you pond for say a parasite or bacterial infection. For an example putting more air in with PP or turning part of your filtration of with a particular treatment or condition
Hi Gazza the first thing I do is test my water it never really alters but better to know it is right.I turn off my protein skimmer but that is about it I turn it on later so some meds run through but I don't want it removing any treatment before it has done it's job.
The reason for this was to see if and what people do and if they think some meds get "stripped" out of the water when leaving things running so i take it that why you turn off your protein skimmer Lee.
I do check all the parameters before and after treatment.
As CT breakdown is accelerated by UV I do however turn UV of when using CT and use CT in the evening, not when it's dark otherwise I couldn't see if the fish were distressed but when the sun has gone down.
I do keep a log of what treatment has been given so I can see if there is a pattern.
Good thread Gazza, and an interesting point, Lee, about turning off a protein skimmer when medicating a pond so as not to strip out the medication. From a water chemistry viewpoint, it makes sense.
There are all sorts of different molecules. Some love water and enjoy being dissolved (hydrophilic), some hate water and if you put them in water, they will just separate themselves out again (hydrophobic). Salt is hydrophilic, it easily dissolves. Oil is hydrophobic, it won't mix with water, it will just form a film on the surface.
There are other more complicated molecules that are a bit like tadpoles, with a water loving head and a water hating tail. Proteins are a typical example, and a protein skimmer uses their tadpole-like characteristics to remove them from water. A protein skimmer is really just a stream of very fine bubbles that turns water to foam in a tube or confined space. In this foam, the protein "tadpoles" have their head in the water around the foam bubbles and their tails in the air inside the bubbles. The foam collects on the surface and then runs away to waste taking the protein "tadpoles" with it.
The reason to turn off a protein skimmer when medicating is because, if there are any water hating molecules or any of the "tadpole" type in it , these will be stripped out by the foam. But, water-falls are simple forms of protein skimmers. The bubbling and churning of the water can separate out molecules. On ponds with a DOC problem sometimes, apart from a tint in the water, the first sign is a frothy foam on the pond surface underneath it.
So, if we are developing a regime for treating a pond and it is a good idea to turn off protein skimmers in case it strips out the medication, should we also turn off water-falls?
I think you must have predicted where I was going next.
I don't have any particular medication in mind, but if a protein skimmer can strip a medication out of water by thrashing the water around, then my next question would have been, "what about Bakki showers. Don't they thrash water around and don't some new converts to Bakkis sometimes ask advice about the froth that suddenly appears underneath them?"
The third question would be controversial. It can only be discussed in a closed forum where we know that to discuss the pros and cons of an idea is not the same as recommending a particular course of action. So here goes: We hear all the time that we should increase aeration when medicating a pond because some medications lower the dissolved oxygen level. True enough, aeration should be increased for those particular medications that do lower oxygen levels but is there ever a case for not increasing it, (or even reducing it!!), to avoid stripping medications that either don't lower oxygen levels or don't reduce the ability of the gills to take up dissolved oxygen?
Hello Everyone
Normally for people without a microscope and no way of getting their hands on one i have a standard treatment regime.
1, FlukeM x2 treatments 1 week apart (Body Flukes, Gill Flukes)
2, Malachite and Formalin x3 1 week apart. (Costia, Whitespot, Chillodonella, Epystylis)
3, Potassium Permanganate. x1 treatment (tricodina)
please note 20% water change and filter clean between each treatment ..and a hoover out too
If the fish look as though they have a lot of mucos on them and struggling..then no2 first.
But as a standard treatment regime the 1,2,3 seems to work pretty well
And either way after a fluke treatment i tend to do 2 MG&F as i find that using any fluke treatment, your effectively worming the fish and costia that is in the gut will be flushed out and land on the fish..i normally find costia in numbers 1 to 2 weeks after a fluke treatment.
So thats a basic without a scope ..
With a scrape and scope i would decide on what will kill the fish first and treat accordingly ..
Max
Hi. I don't think this is going far off topic, but I'm interested in the opinions of furum members on here. I read someones post & I'm almost sure it was not on koiquest. But upon buying some new fish from a dealer/gardon centre or wherever, he/she was advised to treat for whitespot because it would likley kick off & was sold some F&MG.
Obviously it got all the type of replies that you would expect, & that it was bad advice but at least he got another sale etc etc...
I have only introduced new fish on two occasions to my original stock, & on both occasions have had to treat for whitespot, the second time it was particularly hard to shift.
With that in mind I can't help wondering if it was good or bad advice?
Anyway after reading maxine's post it brought it back to mind, so i thought I'd ask
